Home Forums Reloading Varmint Rifles The ultimate 77gr OTM load for my rifles- Please point me in the right direction!

Me:
I'm a hobbyist and varmint hunter. I have no interest in competition other than challenging myself to accurize my rifles and loads.

The rifles:
I just bought a Ruger American Predator in 223 (AR-15 mag version) and I have a Tikka T3X Light on layaway. The Ruger will be converted to run Rugers's AICS 223 mags, if I can make it work. This will allow me to load beyond 2.26", and up to the lands. The Tikka will get a similar conversion for longer OAL. Both rifles have 22" barrels and 1:8" twist. The Ruger will likely get some improvements done to the stock- like adding a cheek riser, free floating the barrel, bedding the action and stiffening the for-end.

What I've learned so far:
The Youtube channel "Johnny's Reloading Bench" (very, very informative channel, and can't say enough good things about it!) has done 15 episodes, and counting, on cloning the Black Hills "MK262 Mod 1" military 5.56 load. That load pushes a 77gr Sierra HPBT MK out of Johnny's 18" and 20" AR-15 barrels at about 2750fps, and consistenty gets 0.5 to 0.75 MOA with rounds sorted for bullet runout. His main goals are to achieve at least the same accuracy and velocity as the Black Hills load. If I recall correctly, he is exclusively using Lake City brass, CCI 41 primers, and the before mentioned Sierra bullet. The Nosler 77 grain OTM was tried early on, but he decided to stay with the Sierra. He is also loading to the same OAL as the black hills load. Here are the 15 powders tried so far in no particular order beyond the third place finisher:

1) AA2520- This powder pretty well matches the Black hills load with 25.2 grains at the right OAL.
2) Shooter World Match Rifle (AKA-Lovex D073-06)- Made by Explosia in the Czech Republic. AA2520 was once made by Explosia, and SWMR is the Explosia version of AA2520 marketed under a different name. AA2520 is now made in belgium. Johnny's rifle shot the same charge of both powders with virtually identical (excellent) results.
3) Alliant Power Pro Varmint- This high energy ball powder was ran about second place in testing behind AA2520/SWMR. Its seemed a little less consistent, but velocity ran a bit higher, and gave the highest velocity of any powder tested.
4) Alliant AR-Comp-
5) CFE-223
6) Varget
7) IMR 8208XBR
8) Hodgdon LeverEvolution
9) IMR 4895
10) H4895
11) Alliant RL15
12) WW748
13) WW760
14) VV N140
15) VV N540
16) WW StaBaLL 6.5

My Goal:
First and foremost is good long range accuracy out to 600 yards or so. I want to work beyond the parameters of the Black Hills load. No component brand or accuracy minded reloading technique will be excluded from consideration. I will be starting off with Sierra and Nosler 77gr OTM bullets, Lapua brass (with high spots turned off the necks), and CCI 450 primers, put together with Wilson hand dies and an arbor press. I'll try some Fed 205M and maybe others when I can find them. Johnny's best loads were all achieved with ball or spherical type powders. I have a good supply AA2520 and PP Varmint, but I'm thinking that temperature resistant stick powders might get me low SD's, low velocity spreads, and minimal vertical dispersion at long range in more varied weather conditions. However, I won't turn my nose up at good ball powder loads!

I will be very grateful for any and all suggestions. Thanks for your time and consideration!!!

Matt

No comment other than I wouldn't waste time and components on the Nosler 77's. I considered using them early on in my .223 reloading since they were a bit cheaper, but I resisted after never hearing of anyone finding them as accurate as the Sierras. Johnny gave them up for a reason.

I wouldnt use the Noslers either. I'd also chitcan the 2520 idea. That powder produces erratic results/lack of consistent accuracy. If you want good speeds with AR Comp, you are going to have to run a real heavy load. Some guys have posted good velocities with it, but with way over book max listings. One powder I'd try, and have had good success with, is X-terminator. I get good velocity and decent accuracy with it.

Ok, guys, I’ll consider scrapping the Nosler OTM, but Johnny did shoot some good groups with the Nosler. I do recall, even with good groups, mostly poor velocity spreads. I don’t yet have any anyway. I do have a few hundred Sierras though. How about similar bullets from Berger and Hornady? I’m also amenable to plastic tip bullets.

How about IMR 4166? I have a fresh pound. Varget seemed to shoot very well, but velocity was a little low. However, Johnny didn’t push his Varget loads up to show any pressure signs at all. I’ll have to keep my eye out for some X-terminator or make a swap with a friend for some. It’s quite fast though, and I suspect low velocities will be had.

Never tried those spendy Bergers.
I shoot mostly Hornady ELD-Ms nowdays if I can find them, Sierra OTMs or TMKs if I can't.

I believe Johnny found that the Federal Match primers got him better accuracy than the CCI 450's. I do use the CCI 450's when I can find them but I will spend a little more for the Federal Match primers when I find them. I have tried 2520 in several loads and like it but not with 77's.

kwg

OP,

Don't know how far it is to the lands on your Ruger, but if you purchase ASC stainless mags you will be able to load to about 2.300" without switching to AICS. $13 might save you hundreds:

https://gunmagwarehouse.com/all-mag...nes--asc-magazines--223-remington--steel

Best of luck with your projects.

That's a great suggestion. Especially for a bolt gun where the throat may be a little long.

That’s is a great idea! Even if they won’t allow me to kiss the lands, it would get me closer, and the five rounders are nice for some hunting jurisdictions.

Just make sure you get the stainless ones. The aluminum mags don't have as much room.

Don’t know if you are stuck on that bullet but it is fairly mediocre for that weight and style of bullet
BC and accuracy it is beaten by many and it has a reputation for throwing fliers for no good reason

Will do, thanks! Perhaps some judicious filing might get another 0.002” or so with the 5 rounders. I’ll order a couple and see.

BTW: While Ruger is charging $40 for their AI style 223 mags on shop Ruger dot com, one can buy them on Gunbroker for as low as $25. I will be getting mine from Gbroker for sure.

I have been loading 77 SMKs with Shooters World Match, 2520, PP Varmint, and IMR8208. For my AR15, 8208 gave the best results. Shooters World Match did well for my son's Tikka. H322 actually gave be the best accuracy of all the powders tried, but also the slowest velocities at 2550 for a 16" barrel.

Im running Varget which meters poorly. But does great with 75
grain Hornady. I would start with Varget for 77 grain.

I have a little bit of Varget left, so I’ll give it a whirl. I have som IMR4166, as well, which is just a touch fast than Varget but not far off.

I am eager to try the 77gr Berger’s!

I am in the midst of reloading some 75gr loads right now for my TC venture II. 5R 9 twist, very smooth bore.
I have a 3 shot and a 5 shot FCW mag. So measured the mags, they will handle a max OAL of around 2.385 @ 2.400 with the 5 shot FCW.

Now the rifle- Found with a slight push it'll take 2.390 with Hornady's 75gr BTHP Match & the round will slide right in @ 2.385.
So set the die to seat 20 thou from the lands to account for any variances & well within the magazine limits. Longer than my AR limit of 2.250.

After working with CFE 223 Meh compared to these 2, I started with World shooter Match, this powder shot great with the Hornady right off.
I started with 24.5 and went up to 25grs which was a bit warm, the Hornady was putting them in a Nickle right from the get go @ 2730fps

Then I tried LVR Like JLB on U-tube, this stuff was very impressive, my max was at 25.3 with Fed AR match SRP @ 2775 FPS.
Some of the best groups I ever shot with this rifle, nobody is going to tell me LVR is only for lever guns LOL. Will load @ 25grs LVR for awhile

Don't know if I will even want to try any 77's, maybe will if they get to the same price as Hornady. Want to do some 68 Hornady's with Match Pwdr.